Guardians of The Lambsfoot!

Half/Stop said:
Have a great weekend fellow Guardians! :D I dropped a little Sambar Stag AW in the pocket today along with another from Titusville that won’t appear here. :eek:
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Thanks Ron :D Nice choice ;) :thumbsup:
 
bonzodog said:
Been asked about my George Wostenholm IXL Lambsfoot.This is not an expensive knife £62.25 plus shipping,but it’s well put together at this price point.Stainless blade 67mm long,85mm long closed,rosewood scales,brass liners.Blade is centred and no blade play present,came fairly sharp out of the box but not hair shaving sharp,no problem to remedy when time permits.
Blade pull is 5 I’d say,easy to pinch open,no half stop but opens with a nice snap.All in all very pleased with it.
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Thanks for the report my friend :thumbsup:
 
Pàdruig said:
Oh, that's interesting. I can't recall the website where I had priced the sheep's horn I was looking at but they were going for around $60 for a set! $8 is far more reasonable.
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I'd be interested to know what specific sheep species those different scales came from. I don't really know anything about sheep horn as a handle material, but I wonder if there is a similar gulf between domestic rams horn, and say Bighorn sheep horn in terms of denseness and durability for knife handles, as there is between the light, pithy antlered deer species, and Sambar antler. Despite the ubiquity of domestic strains of sheep in most countries, there doesn't seem to be a lot of use of their horns for traditional tool and knife handles. Perhaps this is due to the flaking issue? Whereas I understand that Bighorn sheep horn is a superior, and coveted (and probably significantly more expensive) handle material.

Jack Black said:
Thanks pal :) WOW! Yes, that is it! :eek: Outstanding Google-Fu my friend :) Well done :thumbsup: My fob looked to be older than that example, and had a wee ring to attach to a chain, but there's no doubt the image is the same :) Maybe I can even hunt one down, and in any case, I'll enjoy learning more - I had mine before the internet of course. Thanks for making my day.
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No worries, my friend - I'm sure there'll be people in the current incarnation of that union, who'll be able to help you out. They may even have spares floating around of a version of that badge, if you speak with the right person.

Pàdruig said:
I completely understand what you are conveying. I grew up on a farm so it was very, very rare to have to call on somebody else to come out and fix something. We were used to fixing or making stuff ourselves and knives were a big fixture in our upbringing. When I took a job in the nearby city, I soon discovered that it was not unusual for my co-workers to not have a knife in their pocket. They just didn't see the same value in a cutting tool like I did. What I find bizarre and more than a little amusing is that many of these co-workers have become very good friends of mine and despite 15 years they still frequently ask to use my knife when we hang out, as opposed to simply getting one of their own.... I keep threatening to buy them all a solid pocket knife but sadly I think it would simply end up in a drawer somewhere, never to be used...
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Bartleby said:
I was raised in a more urban environment, but we were raised to tinker with things back in the day so my experience is quite parallel to yours. As I worked my way through school prior to entering the teaching profession, I learned a lot of little skills that come in handy. What amazes me is that many of the colleagues will let things literally go to pieces for want of turning a screw tight.
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Interesting to hear of your similar experiences my friends. I regretted making such a sweeping generalisation, almost as soon as I made that post, as I guess self reliance and tinkering can as much be a mindset of the individual, rather than whether they came from a rural or urban background. Dylan I've had that same experience with co workers, who after having the 'Oh, why do you carry a weapon?' conversation, are perpetually asking for me to cut something for them. When they ask 'hey do you have that cutting tool on you?' for a task, I know my work's been done!;):)

Bart, I was shocked to read a post on the forum a while ago (not on the Porch) of someone who purchased a knife, reported that he quite liked it, but his overzealous use of it (ie. cutting things) had ruined it, and it was time for another one (ie. the edge had dulled). Yes, common sense maintenance is certainly becoming mighty uncommon in some quarters!

waynorth said:
The perfect Pear! The nice thing about a sharp knife is, it doesn't stutter at the navel nor the stem; just zips through them all. And this after breaking down dozens of boxes and opening dozens of Christmas cards!!
The pear was lightly crispy, and juicy sweet!!:)
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Pearfect pair, Charlie! For a fellow who claims to care nothing for artistic composition, those are some fine still life Lambsfoot pics! Looks like the Apostle did an excellent sharpening job, judging from the smoothness of those pear slices.:thumbsup:;)

strokednbored said:
I guess this will be my application for the position of :

Probationary Interim Muckraker of the Guardians

I noticed this thread quite a while ago (when I was still firmly entrenched in "lurk mode") and didn't pay it much heed, then a few months ago I decided to start reading through it from the beginning learning about the lambsfoot and it's history. It's not every day you come across a knife you were completely unaware of with all the info at once.

I knew I was interested in trying one of these out but told myself that I would read through the entirety of the thread before I did so.

Well, that task was accomplished on Dec. 5th, so on December 6th I placed an order :D

... and here they are!


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The small one has a pruner handle and has rather well matched white splotches on both sides.
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They both have strong snap after having the pivots cleaned up, and look quite good overall. Although, both blades were a bit overzealous at the grinder around the sharpening notch.

The small is just about perfect, however I'm going to have to play with the large a bit to iron some things out... but I'll save that for another time.
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Welcome strokednbored! Some classic looking Wrights with some nice horn you scored there. Nice work on reading through the whole thread. I'll be interested to hear what you think of the knives, after putting them to work for a while.:thumbsup::cool::)

Jack Black said:
Think I win Doh! Knut of the week...https://www.bladeforums.com/threads...tales-vignettes.754492/page-895#post-17692469 :rolleyes:
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Ouch, I hope that spey blade was sharp at least - I've noticed those cuts heal a whole lot faster than obtuse, ragged edged cuts. I've been guilty of using cyanoacrylate super glue sometimes after doctoring my own cuts, rather than getting a stitch or two at the hospital! (Funnily enough, it's what it was specifically developed for.)

Leslie Tomville said:
Bonzodog, could you please give us a review in words and photos of that IXL? It definitely looks interesting. Congrats.

Jack, what do you think of the IXL knives? I did see one for sale at Sheffield Trading.

These knives are addictive, but lacking in variety. Since the blades cannot be changed, how about working on the bolsters and handles? If they would only just venture out into more options of wood, that step alone would add some interest. Cocobolo, Bocote, or Ironwood are just three example that readily come to mind. The bolsters could also very easily be made to look a lot better by just adding some detailing.

Granted, GEC has many more patterns, but they have shown that changing things up a bit, while staying true to tradition, can keep people interested, (and buying).

I’d love to buy more Lambsfoot knives, but not the same one over and over. Jack, maybe the next Guardian Knife could be used to open the eyes of the Sheffield manufacturers to new possibilities in the bolsters and handle materials?
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Leslie, I think the fluted bolsters on the Guardians knives turned out very well. It seems clear to me from the Guardians edition that Wright's cutlers have the knowledge and skills to make a technically assured knife, if people will pay for the extra time needed to do it.

Like Jack, I'd personally like to see the use of some different steels, tool steels like O1, and D2 (or AEB-L and 12C27 for stainless versions), as well as current industry standard, precision heat treating protocols and techniques, and a bit more attention to fit and finish.

Having said that, I'd love to know if jigged bone scales of the quality of those on this Unity Lambsfoot, are available from anywhere these days - it would take us one step closer to realising a faithful reproduction in the spirit of Mallory's Lambsfoot knife.:)

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Chin I believe that European makers, mainly those in France/Italy, use Mufflon horn from the wild sheep. The Rams certainly have impressive horns when mature. The Mufflon is the wild ancestor of domestic sheep from prehistoric times, but I think that all Sheep horn is good simply because sheep by definition roam freely for months and have a varied natural diet.

Then there are the fascinating Ibex, a mountain goat who sports some great horns too.

I've certainly never had any problems with Ram's Horn knives, no shrink or curl which you will get on cattle horn. Ram's Horn may be tricky to work with but I think there's a reliable supply from Sardinia, Corsica and other Med locations. It's the new old Sambar! Not much used on English knives, yet;)
 
Cambertree said:
I'd be interested to know what specific sheep species those different scales came from. I don't really know anything about sheep horn as a handle material, but I wonder if there is a similar gulf between domestic rams horn, and say Bighorn sheep horn in terms of denseness and durability for knife handles, as there is between the light, pithy antlered deer species, and Sambar antler. Despite the ubiquity of domestic strains of sheep in most countries, there doesn't seem to be a lot of use of their horns for traditional tool and knife handles. Perhaps this is due to the flaking issue? Whereas I understand that Bighorn sheep horn is a superior, and coveted (and probably significantly more expensive) handle material.



No worries, my friend - I'm sure there'll be people in the current incarnation of that union, who'll be able to help you out. They may even have spares floating around of a version of that badge, if you speak with the right person.





Interesting to hear of your similar experiences my friends. I regretted making such a sweeping generalisation, almost as soon as I made that post, as I guess self reliance and tinkering can as much be a mindset of the individual, rather than whether they came from a rural or urban background. Dylan I've had that same experience with co workers, who after having the 'Oh, why do you carry a weapon?' conversation, are perpetually asking for me to cut something for them. When they ask 'hey do you have that cutting tool on you?' for a task, I know my work's been done!;):)

Bart, I was shocked to read a post on the forum a while ago (not on the Porch) of someone who purchased a knife, reported that he quite liked it, but his overzealous use of it (ie. cutting things) had ruined it, and it was time for another one (ie. the edge had dulled). Yes, common sense maintenance is certainly becoming mighty uncommon in some quarters!



Pearfect pair, Charlie! For a fellow who claims to care nothing for artistic composition, those are some fine still life Lambsfoot pics! Looks like the Apostle did an excellent sharpening job, judging from the smoothness of those pear slices.:thumbsup:;)



Welcome strokednbored! Some classic looking Wrights with some nice horn you scored there. Nice work on reading through the whole thread. I'll be interested to hear what you think of the knives, after putting them to work for a while.:thumbsup::cool::)



Ouch, I hope that spey blade was sharp at least - I've noticed those cuts heal a whole lot faster than obtuse, ragged edged cuts. I've been guilty of using cyanoacrylate super glue sometimes after doctoring my own cuts, rather than getting a stitch or two at the hospital! (Funnily enough, it's what it was specifically developed for.)



Leslie, I think the fluted bolsters on the Guardians knives turned out very well. It seems clear to me from the Guardians edition that Wright's cutlers have the knowledge and skills to make a technically assured knife, if people will pay for the extra time needed to do it.

Like Jack, I'd personally like to see the use of some different steels, tool steels like O1, and D2 (or AEB-L and 12C27 for stainless versions), as well as current industry standard, precision heat treating protocols and techniques, and a bit more attention to fit and finish.

Having said that, I'd love to know if jigged bone scales of the quality of those on this Unity Lambsfoot, are available from anywhere these days - it would take us one step closer to realising a faithful reproduction in the spirit of Mallory's Lambsfoot knife.:)

18Dnrka.jpg
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Interesting thoughts on sheep horn my friend, and I suspect that I know considerably less than you about it. There could be very good reasons why it isn't more widely used. I'm told that it can be pretty tough, but of course there are many different types of sheep. More study needed I think :)

Yes, I'll have to get in touch with the union. Thanks for your help and encouragement :thumbsup:

The cut was certainly clean! It's the first time I've gone to the hospital with a cut in a long time, and if I'd known I'd have to wait 3 hours, I'd have just sat it out. I keep a well-stocked first-aid kit, but it's hard to apply steri-strips to your own finger when it's gushing blood, and my kitchen floor was getting messy! :eek: By the time the nurse came to deal with it, I'd had my hand in the air for 3 hours, so it wasn't so bad! :rolleyes: I asked two of the nurses about applying super-glue, as I have always been wary about applying it directly to an open wound, and they were rather aghast, even knowing its history. When I said I had friends who used it fairly regularly to repair minor cuts, one said that while it might save your life in the jungle, she couldn't recommend it for general use. The other just said, "Well, that's men for you!" :D I'm going to have a look at the cut today, so the super-glue might be coming out ;) :D :thumbsup:

I did talk about the use of O1 with Wright's. Despite the fact that they use it for their bushcraft knives, they certainly weren't keen on the idea. Since it would mean extra work and extra wear on the their tools, I expected this, having had much the same conversation with other cutlers in the past in relation to D2. Their bushcraft knives are a lot more expensive than their other knives, which perhaps is partly for that reason. The stock, of course, is too thick for folders, but Sheffield-made O1 is available in suitable stock. I'm unsure of the minimum order of steel though. I'm sure Wright's would use it if I asked, even reluctantly, as long as they could obtain the steel. Something to ponder for the future perhaps. What do folks think about steel liners, as opposed to brass? In terms of HT, upgrading would be very straightforward, but would obviously increase the cost of any SFO :thumbsup:

I think the whole bone industry has just disappeared from Sheffield these days. A real shame, but there hasn't been any real demand for good jigged bone for decades now. I suspect there are still people alive with the skills to work it, but just getting hold of the raw materials might be a challenge these days :( Even with the excellent jigged bone scales produced by other manufacturers, it lacks a hand-worked quality. Always a treat to see your Unity Lambsfoot my friend :thumbsup:

gonebad395 said:
Hey Guardians Merry Christmas to you all Been working a lot slowing up soon can’t wait to catch up with you all agian have a safe and fun holiday.
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Great to see you here Keith, and the same to you my friend, and to all our Guardians :) :thumbsup:
 
Will Power said:
Chin I believe that European makers, mainly those in France/Italy, use Mufflon horn from the wild sheep. The Rams certainly have impressive horns when mature. The Mufflon is the wild ancestor of domestic sheep from prehistoric times, but I think that all Sheep horn is good simply because sheep by definition roam freely for months and have a varied natural diet.

Then there are the fascinating Ibex, a mountain goat who sports some great horns too.

I've certainly never had any problems with Ram's Horn knives, no shrink or curl which you will get on cattle horn. Ram's Horn may be tricky to work with but I think there's a reliable supply from Sardinia, Corsica and other Med locations. It's the new old Sambar! Not much used on English knives, yet;)
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Interesting stuff Will :thumbsup: Sorry, it took me so long to write my post as I took a couple of phonecalls, and didn't see your post until after! :D :thumbsup:
 
Cambertree said:
I regretted making such a sweeping generalisation, almost as soon as I made that post, as I guess self reliance and tinkering can as much be a mindset of the individual, rather than whether they came from a rural or urban background.
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What you said is still mostly true though. It is often easier in the city to find a fellow to fix something, until you find that you are that fellow. When on the farm or in the field the hardest part can be finding the other fellow!
 
Will Power said:
Chin I believe that European makers, mainly those in France/Italy, use Mufflon horn from the wild sheep. The Rams certainly have impressive horns when mature. The Mufflon is the wild ancestor of domestic sheep from prehistoric times, but I think that all Sheep horn is good simply because sheep by definition roam freely for months and have a varied natural diet.

Then there are the fascinating Ibex, a mountain goat who sports some great horns too.

I've certainly never had any problems with Ram's Horn knives, no shrink or curl which you will get on cattle horn. Ram's Horn may be tricky to work with but I think there's a reliable supply from Sardinia, Corsica and other Med locations. It's the new old Sambar! Not much used on English knives, yet;)
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Thanks for the solid info, Will, very useful my friend. Do you know if that durability extends to common domestic Rams horn? I think I recollect GT @5K Qs mentioning he had experienced flaking in Rough Rider sheephorn covered knives.

Jack Black said:
Interesting thoughts on sheep horn my friend, and I suspect that I know considerably less than you about it. There could be very good reasons why it isn't more widely used. I'm told that it can be pretty tough, but of course there are many different types of sheep. More study needed I think :)

Yes, I'll have to get in touch with the union. Thanks for your help and encouragement :thumbsup:

The cut was certainly clean! It's the first time I've gone to the hospital with a cut in a long time, and if I'd known I'd have to wait 3 hours, I'd have just sat it out. I keep a well-stocked first-aid kit, but it's hard to apply steri-strips to your own finger when it's gushing blood, and my kitchen floor was getting messy! :eek: By the time the nurse came to deal with it, I'd had my hand in the air for 3 hours, so it wasn't so bad! :rolleyes: I asked two of the nurses about applying super-glue, as I have always been wary about applying it directly to an open wound, and they were rather aghast, even knowing its history. When I said I had friends who used it fairly regularly to repair minor cuts, one said that while it might save your life in the jungle, she couldn't recommend it for general use. The other just said, "Well, that's men for you!" :D I'm going to have a look at the cut today, so the super-glue might be coming out ;) :D :thumbsup:

I did talk about the use of O1 with Wright's. Despite the fact that they use it for their bushcraft knives, they certainly weren't keen on the idea. Since it would mean extra work and extra wear on the their tools, I expected this, having had much the same conversation with other cutlers in the past in relation to D2. Their bushcraft knives are a lot more expensive than their other knives, which perhaps is partly for that reason. The stock, of course, is too thick for folders, but Sheffield-made O1 is available in suitable stock. I'm unsure of the minimum order of steel though. I'm sure Wright's would use it if I asked, even reluctantly, as long as they could obtain the steel. Something to ponder for the future perhaps. What do folks think about steel liners, as opposed to brass? In terms of HT, upgrading would be very straightforward, but would obviously increase the cost of any SFO :thumbsup:

I think the whole bone industry has just disappeared from Sheffield these days. A real shame, but there hasn't been any real demand for good jigged bone for decades now. I suspect there are still people alive with the skills to work it, but just getting hold of the raw materials might be a challenge these days :( Even with the excellent jigged bone scales produced by other manufacturers, it lacks a hand-worked quality. Always a treat to see your Unity Lambsfoot my friend :thumbsup:



Great to see you here Keith, and the same to you my friend, and to all our Guardians :) :thumbsup:
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Thanks mate, yes I definitely need to learn a bit more about sheep and goat horn structure and durability.

Yes, to be honest, commercial super glue is not recommended for wound binding as it apparently contains other additives in it, compared to military grade CA glue, however when you're gushing blood onto the floor, who's quibbling about that?

I remember the last time I had to get stitches for a cut on the back of my forefinger, from foolishly holding a narrow piece of kindling I was trying to split with a Gransfors Bruks mini-Hatchet. The doctor said 'A hatchet did that? By jeez, it must've been bloody sharp!';):eek::D

I noticed clam shell packs and zip ties came in for a pasting in the Lounge. In my opinion you can add modern band-aid packages to that list too (as well as unattached disposable biro pen lids)!

I'd be all for an O1 run of Lambsfoot blades, and willing to pay for it. D2 is one of the steels which seems to benefit strongly from cryogenic soaking and aging - this I would also pay for, after experiencing the difference in the cryo treated steel in the Lambshank and test mule of the same steel.

I recognise it may not be to everyone's taste, but I would much prefer steel liners and pins too. Maintaining a carbon steel blade is one thing, and has a payoff in terms of achievable edge fineness, stability and toughness, but why have a liner scale and pin material where you have to worry about verdigris taint over time?

You would just need to choose the right steel to ensure that there is a complete martensitic transformation, for the lower hardness required for scales and pins. I have seen warped steel liners on some old Sheffield and Solingen knives - I think this is due to the steel not achieving a complete martensitic transformation. When retained austenite ages, or is worked over time, it can transform to martensite subsequent to finishing. This involves a dimensional expansion of 14%, which is certainly enough to distort the form of the steel. I think this is why Victorinox use slightly different (lower carbon) grades for the tools on SAKs, and lower again for the liners and springs. Cryo treatment also helps with dimensional stability and transforming all retained austenite, which is one of the reasons why it is now the standard industry heat treatment for tool steel gauges and dies.

Jack Black said:
Yes! :D The more talented of the two in my opinion ;) :D :thumbsup:



Note '15' rating :thumbsup:
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Good stuff, mate.

Bartleby said:
What you said is still mostly true though. It is often easier in the city to find a fellow to fix something, until you find that you are that fellow. When on the farm or in the field the hardest part can be finding the other fellow!
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True, my friend, and well said.
 
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